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Post by mrqwerty on Jul 20, 2006 14:55:18 GMT 10
Would be a shame if the forum ends despite all the odd left turns it's taken.....musicians are never short of an opinion......apart from the odd occasional stoush still happening viz the Visions thread, things have cooled down a lot...
A central portal for news and opinion is a valuable thing.
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Post by ladylex on Jul 20, 2006 15:27:03 GMT 10
Im almost bawling my eyes out to read Mark’s post. I really am. *sadface Aside from applying blame to anyone right now (though, I daresay plenty will be more than happy to do so), does anyone see any immediate and possible solutions? (I must admit.. I really enjoyed Mr S.Tinkler’s offerings when they were er.. offered) Does anyone have positive ideas? I do have one - but its one that would best happen behind the scenes IMO via email and PMs rather than in full view of everyone on here. Oh. And sorry.. my ‘leaving’ prolly wont be happening. Especially as my impressions are that Mark does enjoy having me around  Of course, if Mark does express his dissatisfaction with my presence, I will be more than happy to withdraw. I respect Mark a great deal.. if none of you can tell LOLs. I believe, contrary to some posts, that the jazz community is quite supportive. IRL though. Its so easy behind a computer for people's insecurities to appear augmented and overblown. If there is one piece of advice I can offer: Can we please treat Mark, as Moderator et al, with a great deal more respect and appreciation? Whilst I know many of you do, there are also many who do not – who also do not hesitate to take out their angst and insecure lil pieces of krapiness on Mark as well. This is honestly the first forum Ive ever belonged to where the Moderator is not seen as God. Its very strange to me. |
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Post by andrewh on Jul 20, 2006 19:36:44 GMT 10
By and large it's difficult not to agree with Mark, though. On occasion this place really lived up to its potential of being the hub of the community, though those days are long gone. The insufferable rantings of a few, the obsession of the last-word gang always to have the last word, the dominating and domineering activities of a small number of contributors - who have to have their say on everything, and have to dictate everybody else's opinions and standards on everything - have made this a disspiriting place to be. Since, in its current form and with its current tone, it is unlikely to recapture the enthusiasm and contributions of those who made this such a vibrant and fun place to be - if occasionally overrun by backbiting - then the death knell should surely be sounded. Well done and thank you, Mark, for creating such a valuable resource and for running it so effectively for so long. Congratulations also for identifying the moment at which it had outlived its useful life, and for proposing appropriate action.
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Post by captain on Jul 20, 2006 20:17:52 GMT 10
This is a bit out of the blue... nothing bad has gone down recently at all!! What's the problem?
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Post by don jordan on Jul 20, 2006 21:49:39 GMT 10
This is sad news, and I want to thank Mark for giving us all the opportunity of the Forum. I've not posted much, partly because I looked for in-depth discussion on topics and it didn't eventuate on the times that I tried. I've looked at a lot of threads and postings, and have to agree with Mark about the level and tone of them. I've found another forum on the 'All About Jazz' site which seems to cater for the level of discussion I look for. I've had some great responses already to a posting there. The posters are a positive lot, and I need that. I don't like being belittled, and I really don't know anyone who does, so why do people do it? I felt I had a lot of experience to offer this forum, but there was little interest. I'm not aware of postings from older people here - unlike the other forum. I think the younger ones have lost a great opportunity to learn from, and bond with, people who have been involved in the scene for 50 years and more - but I would say that, wouldn't I? Cheers, all.
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Post by mim on Jul 21, 2006 2:04:15 GMT 10
All About Jazz does have a very good forum, I've been a member of it for quite some time. Don, you're right, there is a lot more positivity there, and you ask a simple question and get five pages of responses, with suggestions and discussion. Kenny mentioned this in the "Visions" thread, that the AAJ may run more effectively because there are fewer musicians on the site.
Since I joined OzJazz, and especially since I moved to Melbourne, I have spent less time there, for a couple of reasons. For starters here are only so many "Who's you're favorite drummer?" threads one can take (mispelling intended). But also, on AAJ there are people from all over the world, and none of them seem to be involved in the same scene as each other, which has its obvious benefits, but it's very impersonal.
What I really have enjoyed about OzJazz is that it is, for the most part, so relevant to the scene I've been trying to get involved in. You can (could?) talk to the musicians, not just about them. OzJazz introduced me to players I never would have known existed. It gave me an insight into their music, and their motivation for doing what they do, the way they do it. There is no other place to gain that kind of understanding. No place where someone who is essentially nobody (in the eyes of the australian jazz community as a whole) can participate in a discussion -- about the values of thoughtful constructive criticism, or the benefits/ drawbacks of a jazz festival showcasing only women, for example -- with respected members of the jazz community, including players, writers, festival directors, and other important roles.
Admittedly, the forum does not currently resemble my above description because many of the people who made it what it was seem to have vamoosed, or atleast stopped participating as much (Kenny, Tinky, Shaggaz, March, Vicki, Tuggsey, Belinda, Scrote, to name a few). Ideally it could begin to return to its former caliber if said people would make their collective presence be known once more, although I guess that would take something fairly drastic. I hope that a few of these people return to share their thoughts on this matter, even if they don't return more permanently.
It would be great if people didn't give up on this place quite yet, I'm not going to start talking about it in past tense until it's gone. Mark, I still believe there are ways to rejuvinate this forum. There are hundreds of people involved in jazz scenes in states other than VIC & NSW that are totally unaware this place exists. Not only that, but I think a lot of them are fairly unaware of most of the great music being produced in this country. I'm willing to help create awareness, particularly in SA, and I hope people with ties to other places would be willing to do the same. It can't hurt, and wouldn't it be fantastic if it could result in a more connected national jazz community as a whole? Maybe I'm being a little too idealistic. But a bit of uber-optimism might do us some good, I hope it's contagious. This place has been more than a valuable resource for me, and I think it could be for others as well.
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Post by antboy on Jul 21, 2006 2:32:54 GMT 10
Hi all,
In regards to the more open (less "in-house") and generally better informed conversations ( often about music! whoa! ) found at ' all about jazz' and 'jazz corner speakeasy' etc,
yeah I agree these websites benefit from not such a large percentage of musicians posting, also people from all over the world, etc...
But is this not the reason people come to ozjazzforum? for the opposite?!
People come here to chat with friends, announce gigs, gush about their Friend's music, shit stir, and the occasional nastiness of bagging others (although nearly ALWAYS anonymously).
And also to try to work out who everyone's pseudonyms are, no?!
Because of this "IN-HOUSE-NESS" everyone sits on the fence in fear of offending a friend,
OR
offers unnecessary abuse, but anonymously!
I rarely had the feeling that many people really wanted to discuss more serious stuff, if you have an opinion you get blamed as some kind of intellectual snob, or a third rate musician!
Peace!
: )
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Post by alimcg on Jul 21, 2006 21:33:42 GMT 10
Well said mim.
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sammo
New Member
Posts: 39
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Post by sammo on Jul 21, 2006 23:36:34 GMT 10
Yeah it would be sad if things went south. I didn't even realize how heated things were getting until clicking on the Visions thread yesterday.
I was up late last night fiddling around (yes I need a life), and have put together a forum on the MJO website, feel free to use or not to use if Ozjazz folds, though I hope it doesn't!
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Post by glean on Jul 22, 2006 2:27:31 GMT 10
I think this place has suffered enormously because of a few extremely paranoid buggers but mostly good stuff has come out of it . I have read some really funny stuff here too and learnt a lot. There were good times and bad times but if you look at the balance over the years it has mainly been good times. The bad ones are more memorable especially if you are the one stung.
My suggestion would be leave it alone for a few mre months before pulling the plug and it might just fix itself. Another idea would be to only let people sign up under their real name.
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Post by mim on Jul 22, 2006 13:06:45 GMT 10
Is Glen your real name?
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Post by glean on Jul 22, 2006 19:18:08 GMT 10
Yes is Mim yours? Let's see that passport!
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Post by mim on Jul 23, 2006 0:00:44 GMT 10
Yep, just Mim. No last name. Like Madonna. Or Cher. Or.... Elmo.
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Post by ladylex on Jul 25, 2006 10:18:44 GMT 10
or the pope! ;D *worships Her Holiness |
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Of course, if Mark does express his dissatisfaction with my presence, I will be more than happy to withdraw. I respect Mark a great deal.. if none of you can tell LOLs.
